Hi guys,

just to let you know the "download mp3" link is pointing to the wrong place. Clicking on the link gives a "forbidden" error. the Play links works fine though!

Ah, I see what I did wrong. The download button is fixed now. Thanks, Andreas!

Nice intro. Would have liked more samples of artists beside the co-host, when they were illustrating styles, rather than having them listed separately.

This was an extremely interesting and educational podcast. I plan to feature it at our next poetry and music club meeting on campus here at OC Tech (Orangeburg, SC).

I have been looking forward to a Pandora Podcast that featured Hip Hop for sometime. I enjoyed it, I had a slight inclination of how rap rhymes worked but this episode explained it to me in full I thank you for that.

My question is; will you feature a podcast focusing on Grime (UK HIP HOP), its development and the differences between grime and hip hop from the US?

Renuka: Unfortunately, that's illegal. We can't sample well-known songs within the free podcast itself, as that would violate copyright law. I'd love to bring those examples right in, but for now we have to list them separately.

Tamara: Excellent!! That makes us very happy to hear that. Three cheers to the OC Tech poetry & music club.

Luron: Grime, eh? I would like to cover grime. I'll have to do some research, though, as my grime background is somewhat limited. I know Dizzee Rascal, the Streets, and Lady Sovereign, as they're the main grime artists who have gotten a lot of Stateside push. Who else do you recommend? And who were really the grime pioneers?

Looks like the RSS feed to iTunes users is acting strange again, no MP3 is being embedded...

Well if you want to know about Grime you need to first look at Garage music. That is where it all started. Young second generation immigrants from the Caribbean invented this Genre from speeding up Reggae/Dub/ragga B-sides and toasting over them while trying to keep in timing with the record and combining it with Techno. From this the accent changed(1) and so did the beats(2) then came Dizzy, wiley, Sway (must listen to him).

(1)When I say the accent changed I mean instead of trying to toast in Jamaican or African/English they used their Inner-city London accent. You can hear it when listening to Dizzy and Wiley, then comparing it with The Streets. You will find that The Streets and Roots Manuva have a totally different accents. Then if you listen to Kano or The Mitchelle Brothers, though they use similar timings as The Streets their accent is totally different to The Streets, Dizzy and Wiley.

(2)Perfect example of the change in beats is comparing Dizzy Rascal's "I'm just a rascal" and Wiley's "Eskimo" are on Garage beats; then look on Kano "Nite nite" and "sometimes".

So for you research I recommend Roots Manuva (closer to US-Hip Hop), The streets (melody), Example (accent change), Dizzy Rascal (garage beats and Grime beats), some stuff from double-99 (garage DJs), Sway (melody and accents), Shameless (beats and rhythm), MIA Arular (crazy), Lethal Bizzle (maybe) and Plan B (acoustic grime).

Fantastic. See, that's why I love these comments pages. More of that! Rock on, Luron.

I love the riffs.

Awesome podcast -- very educational. I love the flow that Darian has, it's simply amazing.

why wouldn't having small samples of the songs inside the podcast, especially given the review-educational nature, fall within the domain of 'fair use' with respect to copyright?

I'll note however that there are great advantages to having the same artist demonstrate the different nuances and variations. Because you are hearing them from the same source, you don't get distracted by other differences (such as sound of someone's voice, how they are mic'd the backing music, etc) and can better hear and concentrate on what's being demonstrated.

That being said, I'd love love love it if you were able to go to a basis of having your in studio guest demonstrate something, and then be able to follow it with a brief sample from an more 'classic' example.

Even then however I like having the slightly longer samples available as almost a type of 'homework' where you can try to apply what you learned in the podcast and recognise the instance of the concept in the examples..

Oh, yes! This was great! I have actually been looking alot around for this type of tech-talk about rapping styles.

Some useful links for those who are unnaturally interested:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rap#Rhyme_styles
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhyme_scheme

However, I felt that it was way too short. I'd listen for an hour. ;)

Mr. Seal, here comes another request:

Can you please (please!) go even more in-depth on 'Alternative hip-hop'? You scratched the surface of this topic while mentioning Hieroglyphics and poetry, but I'd love to learn more about the structure behind the hardcore hip hop poets like 'Busdriver' and 'Lyrics Born'. The sort of hip hop that is not really targeted at anyone (like mainstream hip hop). It's pure, uncompromised expressions.

Oh, I'd love to get some expert comments on this topic.

Anyway, thanks alot for this introduction.

* Applauding Darian Gray and wishing the best of luck *

Best Regards,
ErlendBV

PS @ cernenus : I think the 'fair use' is really strict, as I wasn't allowed by the local music authority to use a second of published audio for educational purposes on the Norwegian Wikipedia-pages without paying houndreds of USD per minute per month. And I guess it just isn't worth it. ;)

This is a really interesting website. i like the fact that you can make your own station, and pick the songs that you want!!!!!!!!!!! I like it!

2pac

Excellent, guys.

Erlend, absolutely -- more Alternative hip-hop on the way. Lyrics Born is a particular favorite of mine. All those Solesides guys, amazing writers.

And yeah, Cernernus, what Erlend wrote is indeed true. It's prohibitively expensive to include even small samples of the actual recordings within the downloadable show. Unfortunately, it doesn't fall under 'fair use.'

Not to get into a copyright discussion, but it seems odd that you can include samples on the site itself (w/o paying) but not on the podcast...Or are the two instances "priced" differently?

I have been looking forward to a Pandora Podcast that featured Hip Hop for sometime. I enjoyed it, I had a slight inclination of how rap rhymes worked but this episode explained it to me in full I thank you for that.

Hi, T,

Here's the difference:

The podcasts are downloadable. You can possess that file, for free, and take it with you anywhere. That's why we can't play un-cleared audio clips in it.

Those audio samples you hear are label-approved excerpts, and are only for streaming, not for downloading.

hey u guys are great i love what your doing keep it up

Love the lessons, and I admire the idea of emceeing and drumming simultaneously. I just hope dude sounds a lot less like DEL real life.

What about female MCs? I see Lady Sovereign mentioned, but what about Psalm One? Bahamadia? They're both pretty innovative, vocally and lyrically.

Great series. I listened to all 8 episodes today, but I had to download the episodes. Clicking "Listen Now" changes the button to yellow, but I don't hear any audio. Also, the Reggae episode cuts off at 7:37. I look forward to listening to the next episode. Thanks!

hey great podcast. I really enjoyed the insight into hip hop. I'm curious though, what about different time signiture 4/4 is great, but what about 3/4 or we can get a bit wild and suggest 5/4
can you give some suggestions if there are any of rappers using different timing?

Ooooh, that's a tough one, Jared. I can't think of any MCs who rap in odd time signatures. Anybody out there know of any who do?

This is really interesting-- my respect for Hip Hop has, unfortunately, been formed by what I see on the commercial market which I know isn't the best example. But I just haven't had time to really get into it. Plus, it is really difficult to know the artists without knowing someone who is into the more artistic, underground stuff.
Plus, most of the hip hop songs are about sex and money and anger I really don't want to listen to music that's without some form of realness to it. Then again, I guess only the commercial stuff is just about sex and money. The anger stuff is interesting, but just not what I want to get into.
However, the mention of Grime here on the comments has arrested my attention...

Fellas,
I was doing some writing yesterday, and after 4 bars, was like, F--! This sounds like some Dr. Seuss. Don't get me wrong, I went out and saw Horton... as soon as it came it (was one of my favorite books as a kid). Before getting too down, I then broke out of the judgment and just got into writing and not worrying about where the rhyme landed.
Today I listen to your lesson, and your wonderful presentation put a whole new perspective on things for me. I now see the patterns that I always admired and wondered about, but never analyzed, and you guys made it sooo clear.
Big Ups

odd times?
a few guys out of DC (i think) sub zero, kokai, black indian with steve coleman and the metrics (sax player) check m-base.com have freestyled over his odd time beats, and later perhaps got it down to rhyme in 5 and 7, i was there, (live in paris album) it flipped my mind. UK rapper Mystro, a fair amount in 3/4 myspace.com/mysdiggi... there may be a track up there giving you a taste.

nice podcast... will be taken in the ROYAL ACADEMY of MUSIC in london... help my students undertand what they are missing.

Thanks, guys!

Hendy -- That's great that you jumped in to writing without worrying about where the rhymes land. That's a really liberating way to go about it, and leave it to the listeners (if they like) to dissect the rhyme patterns. Keep writing, eh!

Barak -- Thanks for the odd-rhyme examples. I will check out Sub Zero, Kokai, Black Indian with Steve Coleman and the Metrics. And Mystro. The examples on Steve Coleman's M-Base.com are great. Cheers to the Royal Academy of Music, eh! Thanks for playing our show for your students.

For a LOT of info on Hip-Hop rhyme schemes, check out -

http://www.amazon.com/How-Rap-Art-Science-Hip-Hop/dp/1556528167

www.howtorapbook.com