I received this link from you Kevin in a yahoo songwriting group.
I have been writing songs for the past 15 yrs myself and this unique lesson is very skillful and wise when it comes to instructing people on chord changes....

You wouldn't believe how many types of songs are written in this manner....with such great samples too!!

I do recommend that you put more pop, soul, and r&b samples as well....

Hi, Alexsandria! Thanks for checking out the episode. I'd like to use more soul and R&B examples, too -- there were more of those in earlier episodes, but definitely ought to be more in future shows. Cheers, and thanks again.

La pagina de clases de música esta
exelente.
Me gustaria tenerla en español si es
posible.
Muchas gracias
Daniel Matarrita.
Costa Rica América Central.

I love this series. So little music journalism gets into the nuts and bolts of songcraft. A follow-up piece on modal progressions (Dorian and Mixolydian are two common modes often found in pop) might be worthwhile. Thanks again.

There is an almost perfect song (called "Folk Song") that could be used to demonstrate some of this. It was written by a quirky little Seattle based group called Uncle Bonsai. Sadly it appears that Pandora doesn't know them and that are published on a somewhat obscure lable so I'm not sure how I'd go about getting them submitted..

You can read the lyrics on this site here, which gives you an idea perhaps, but of course without the music... http://www.yellowtailrecords.com/lyrics/lyr_myn.html

Also a small 30 second sample from amazon here http://www.amazon.com/gp/recsradio/radio/B000003Y0X gives a little taste at least... Hmmm have to drop them a line and suggest they submit their stuff to pandora.. I'd make a station for them..

Anyway I digress, this is a GREAT podcast series, and I've been loving every one.. Can't wait to see what's next.

Fantastic series, clear, informative and accessible to all, beats hours of staring at complex music theory willing it to make sense! Thanks and look forward to more.

another great podcast. Loved the contrast affect in like a hurricane, minor/major, but the sadness sounded the same in winterlong, though it was in a major key. ahhh the power of words! Only thing I missed or am not sure of is I've been told blues is played in major and minor both has to do with flattening the 3rd & I think 7th, so what's real or is it becuz it's played all ways and depends on who you talk to?? anyway great job thanks. a loyal fan.

really dug this episode guys - the E>Em progression is one of my favorite changes.

I really like how this series put context around music one hears all the time!

Thanks, guys!

And Sunshine/Rainbow, I agree that Neil Young is a master of those emotionally powerful lyrics.

In blues, yes, the seventh is flatted, and the third becomes ambiguous between major and minor -- often having the third bent up toward the major if played on guitar -- so is often right in between what we think of as major or minor.

Now this was just an excellent program for the musician and the non-musician.

Excellent Excellent Excellent

It is excellent if someone writes or listen to music with sad or happy lyrics or sad or happy notes, that is exactly why music is an art and people decide to listen to what they like.

Thank you for the lesson. Congratulations.

Very happy to hear it, Chris and Niurka. Thanks for listening.

It's interesting to see how many Neil Young songs are text-book illustrations. Thanks for the enlightening lesson on tonality and key changes.

Nice, it sounds good.

This is a great idea. When I have time, I'll come back to it again. Thanks

thankssssssssssssss!!!!!:)
you are the best guys!!nice choices..

Interesting, very interesting. And educative too. Now I can tell the difference between a Minor and Major. Wow, I even know how it sounds like clearly. Kudos to you all!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for great series guys!
After listening to a bunch hard/heavy songs on Pandora I noticed, that almost every of them is in minor scale. I talked to some of my musician friends, and they confirmed, that almost all hard/heavy is played in minor (and the major is considered uncommon/untypical).
Could You please explain to me, why is it so? Why minor all the time?

Ah, it's heartwarming to hear that you're enjoying the series.

To your question on hard/heavy songs, Arsen:

As a lot of hard & heavy music tends to be more geared toward expressing anger, angst, frustration, strife, etc., those emotions just naturally find a home more easily in minor keys, I think.

Sorrow and sadness is more commonly involved in that major/sad dichotomy we talk about in the episode, but lyrics of anger and sheer FORCE tend to want more direct expression, and those lyrics find that expression in loudness, volume, more loudness, and minor keys.

One hard rock band who plays in major keys a lot: AC/DC. This also makes sense with the humor, levity and raucous celebration present in many of the AC/DC lyrics.

A great initiative!
Thank you and congratulations!
All the best!

As one forward thinking music educator, I'm very pleased that Pandora values "music education" enough to produce such a program. I'm also very pleased that music education has reached a level of prominence in the a higher-tech community.

Now, may I offer some criticism?
Please take it constructively.

As someone who teaches music to children from their earliest years (birth) through to college level and professional musicians, may I please object to how major and minor are portrayed the way you did? I do agree on this point: in a very general way, minor and major do have an impact on something that goes beyond the objective.

Question: Where do other tonalities come in? Scarborough Fair, Gilligan's Island, What Can You Do With a Drunken Sailor and others-- these, and some number of others, are songs that are neither major nor minor.

And what of other very beautiful but lesser known tonalities? How can one describe the taste of salt, or color, or other things under-describable in language? Let's strive to teach objectively first, and let children--and adults--to add the subjective meaning. If it's inherent, they'll come to the same conclusions without any guidance. In other words, I believe that you're teaching something that does NOT really need your guidance. The objective understanding of major and minor (as well as the other tonalities). . . well, that needs some objective, formal guidance.

Again, understand that the attempt to teach this stuff on the web is EXTREMELY COMMENDABLE!! I just wish someone would call me before this was posted as good music education.

My colleagues might not agree with me either, but at the very least, it was worth it for me to spend some time to write you. My thoughts on this matter got clearer as I wrote.

Consider writing back.

:-)

DrRizz

I am a new pastor. I love traditional gospel music, and I am so glad to have found Pandora I really enjoy listening to your music as I go about my sermon writing, or just relaxing. I sing a little, and its nice to hear some of the old gospel music that is so hard to find.
Thank you.
Rev. lgtillery

To the folks at Pandora-this (and others like it) are great features! As a guitarist, it is interesting and inspiring to see how music is constructed and feeling can be conveyed (i am specifically speaking of this podcast about minor/major keys). I don't agree with the music instructor on the issue of how he might feel that you are somehow telling or coercing young musicians to use certain tonalities to get certain feelings across.(at least i think that is what he was objecting too) It is up to the musician to do that. I think that this feature was great in that it simply shows how popular music was put together and how that construction can give certain feeling to the music, nothing more.
Michael

Thank you, Michael. I'm happy to hear that you enjoyed it.

Dr. Rizz, I definitely see your point. In the future, I do want to address some of the other tonalities, which may come across as more subtle to an untrained ear.

We're not intending to say that this is how major or minor SHOULD be used, or even that these tonalities are always employed in the service of specific emotional feels.

I merely wanted to communicate that major and minor chords often color the mood of the song, and that listeners could deepen their experience of enjoyment by trying to hear how these tonal shades come to play. Is that not objective to encourage that sort of listening?

As for the songs you mentioned, I believe we did present a few examples of ambiguous key. The song that closes the episode, "Passing Days," is neither major or minor. ("Gilligan's Island" is modal, but clearly leaning toward a minor, wouldn't you say?)

I look forward to continuing our conversation, and am thrilled that you care enough about the show to write in. Thank you for listening.

response to KS

KS:
We're not intending to say that this is how major or minor SHOULD be used, or even that these tonalities are always employed in the service of specific emotional feels.

DR:
I didn't get that as your intention. And I say "good!" to what you said in response here.

KS:
I merely wanted to communicate that major and minor chords often color the mood of the song, and that listeners could deepen their experience of enjoyment by trying to hear how these tonal shades come to play. Is that not objective to encourage that sort of listening?

DR:
I don't understand the phrase "objective to encourage listening." Can you clarify?

hm You may be encouraging listening by asking folks to try to take some understanding FROM what they hear in the music, rather than them bringing
meaning TO it.

Major and Minor tonalities, as well as major and minor functions (chords in relationship to a tonality), have long been related to moods, but trying to listen for sad and happy, or bright and dark, or any other description of the "sound" does not hone the ear as well as an objective way to hear, recognize, identify and understand, major and minor tonalities --and 5-6 others--and the context they provide for chord functions and melodies.

Mood or expression can be given to the music, but I've heard as many "moody" musicians who are not so good. . . And neither are the ones who have gobs of chops and no expression. They're some of the worst.

KS:
we did present a few examples of ambiguous key. The song that closes the episode, "Passing Days," is neither major or minor. ("Gilligan's Island" is modal, but clearly leaning toward a minor, wouldn't you say?)

DR:
Nope. I wouldn't. It's tonic chord is minor, but the tonality is not minor at all. It is distinct from minor, to me, as much as minor is distinct from major. Gilligan's Island is a song where the melody ends on RE of the DO RE MI scale. Minor songs end on LA. Major songs end on DO. These resting tones define the tonality.

The functions that are generated by those tonalities usually have a mixed basket of major, minor, and other kinds of chords. How they get put together well is a function of a composer or good listener who has a solid level of objective understanding.

To me, teaching tonalities through the conceptual understanding of moods or emotions is very treacherous ground on which to walk, especially if the ears haven't had enough and appropriate informal and formal experiences first. Those experiences should be part of basic music training, but unfortunately, I find few teachers that teach the ear to discriminate, label, read, write, improvise, compose and perform music except through concepts.

Who thinks they can ever explain Ray Charles on music paper, or through theory. How about, "Ew man, did you hear that note? It ripped me up."

Now, go ahead and respond to the ripping you just received, but no language is allowed.

Now we're getting into something deeper. . .

Sorry I got off track a bit. Interested in all your thoughts.

peace

DR: I don't understand the phrase "objective to encourage listening." Can you clarify?

KS: I was referring to the phrase in your first post: "The objective understanding of major and minor (as well as the other tonalities). . . well, that needs some objective, formal guidance."

As far as objectivity goes, we are encouraging people to listen for major and minor chords, and for melodies that straddle the two. We have no intention to conflate mood with tonality.

DR: trying to listen for sad and happy, or bright and dark, or any other description of the "sound" does not hone the ear as well as an objective way to hear, recognize, identify and understand, major and minor tonalities.

KS: Point taken. We could have left out how the chords make us feel, and that likely would have adhered more closely to the formal study of music theory. That said, these shows are intended more for entertainment than for formal instruction. We hope to inspire people to study music and music theory, not to supplant any actual academic pursuit. I agree that people would be better off actually studying music theory than relying on our shows to impart that information.

That said, though, we insist on accuracy. Consider this episode a primer. An introductory piece, merely explaining what major and minor chords are.

Great lesson,its amazing how subtle changes can sway the coarse of a song,and take the listener right along with it,most helpful,Thanks..

Indeed. It only takes a slight change in the breeze to send the whole ship on a different course.

I've always enjoyed practicing my scales.
The minor scale has always been a favorite of mine, the good old Aeolian, Im also fond of
the mixolydian.the Major "Ionian" has always seemed less thought provoking,and too perky.
Ah I can't forget the spanish Phrygian.. I spent so many sleepless nights getting down. this has been a very fun podcast.. thanks

Excellent! Good to hear, Joe. I'm a big fan of the Phrygian myself. I sense a show on Diatonic Modes in the future...

I was just listening to "Every time we say goodbye". At the line "How strange the change from major to minor" I immediately thought of this podcast! It perfectly illustrates the emotional changes.

Really like the podcasts, but I can't get the music examples to play. Any suggestions?

this was really helpful thanks, i really like this pandora idea. in order to fulfill its usefullness it needs to somehow get EVERY band, even the super underground ones.

Hi, Jeff... hmm. Update your Flash player, perhaps? I don't know why the music examples wouldn't play for you. Write back if that doesn't work for you, and I'll troubleshoot it more.

And, uh, Someguy: We LOVE underground bands. Please, underground bands, get in touch. You should be played on Pandora as well.

Great series. I listened to all 8 episodes today, but I had to download the episodes. Clicking "Listen Now" changes the button to yellow, but I don't hear any audio. Also, the Reggae episode cuts off at 7:37. I look forward to listening to the next episode. Thanks!

I've been looking for a "cool" way to help my 5th graders hear the difference between major and minor. For those "way too cool to be singing adolecent boys" I think they will enjoy listening to your show more than singing folk songs.

Sweet! Happy to hear it. Hearing major and minor can be tricky for students -- we volunteer at a school in Oakland from time to time, showing music to third graders, and major-and-minor is a tough one for them.

Man, I love those Romantic composers. I wish we would have more music that could be so interactive and so atmospheric. I really miss the guys like Pink Floyd who were taking that kind of idea seriously – it's not that we have to be overly dramatic, but the we should definitely try and create atmospheres and mood.
I'm glad to see mention of Howie Day – in my opinion, he is quite underrated and I think he deserves a lot more attention than he currently gets. I really enjoy his style and songwriting : plus he has the kind of voice I really wish I could have!

Is there such a thing as a song that is played with major chords but as a whole the song is in minor key such as polly by nirvana or drunken lullabies by flogging molly (verse part only)

Never mind about polly i just listened to the guitar riff episode and found out that powerchords are not necessarily major key but im still wondering about drunken lullabies