More on the Copyright Ruling

March 12th, 2007 by in Uncategorized

A huge thank you to everyone who has been so supportive over the past week as we’ve been hit by the stunning ruling on webcast rates. It’s very heartening for us to see how much people care about this, and how willing listeners are to pitch in. And how many of you there are!!
There has been an enormous groundswell of opposition to this decision, and we’ve been hard at work on how to best channel the energy in the right direction. Because the webcasting community does not have an entrenched and powerful lobbying presence in DC, grassroots legislative pressure – constituents contacting their representatives – is clearly our biggest ally.
Internet radio is hostage to a blatantly discriminatory double standard that was written into the federal statute governing webcasting several years ago, following an intensive lobbying effort by the RIAA. We need to redress this, and create a more level playing field – one that of course rewards musicians for their work (I spent years in a band van myself and have always been driven by a desire to lift up musicians), and one that also understands the business realities, and benefits of online radio.
While we figure this out, below are a few of the more informative write ups we’ve seen in the past week. We also suggest that you visit and sign this petition put together by a collection of webcasters.
Doc Searls Blog
Jason Fry article in Wall Street Journal
LA Times Editorial
Thanks again for your support.
Tim (Founder)

Pandora

The Pandora Team http://www.pandora.com/

97 thoughts on “More on the Copyright Ruling”

  1. I guess the big Q is, are the artists highlighted here, are they represented by (i.e., “signed”) by companies that restrict the free distribution of their works?

  3. there are so many comments, i doubt anybody will read mine : (. It has come to the point where I dont even listen to the RIAA’s justification or reasoning behind attacks. With its history of extortion and foul play I have lost all respect for them and I speak for many when I say I would be pleased to see them shut down.

  4. One good way is to settle an arrangement with the Record Labels by offering them free advertisement in exchange of a “non-legal action” agreement in order to mantain the status.
    Good Luck!

  5. I love Pandora. I discovered it a few days ago and it’s precious. Love the way you match stuff to listeners. And yes, Pandora gives you a taste of so many artists – you end up wanting to buy the ones you really enjoy.

  7. Mark E,
    Regarding the out-of-country listeners,
    Comments at this blog are moderated. If anyone at Pandora had a problem with the truth (that there are millions of non-US listeners who love Pandora and some write their support in this thread), would they not block those comments, including this comment?
    I LOVE PANDORA
    Best wishes,
    Denmark

  8. Tim will be reappearing on The Awful Show this coming Friday, March 23 to talk about everything going on with Pandora.
    We look forward to talking with you again Tim!

  9. I’ve only listened in a couple of times, but I did enjoy those experiences. The RIAA needs to keep its hands in its own cookie jar and quit reaching for every other one it can see.

  10. All of these testimonials about how Pandora is helping you find new artists are terrific. This is exactly what the folks behind this decision need to see. Radio has always been the most powerful source of promotion – and seeing such overwhelming evidence is really important. We’re going to figure out how to make sure this data finds its way into the right hands.
    Thanks again, everyone. Cheers Tim (Founder)

  11. Screw the RIAA!
    These guys have lost there minds. Pandora is a cool service and this just one more way they found to screw people. I hope you guys can get by this somehow. Eventually the RIAA will destroy there own business by making greed a higher priority than common sense. We should stop supporting there members, stop buying products the they benefit from. Every time they want more $$$ are they just going to cry to congress and get the laws changed? Since I think I’m paying too much in tax can I go to congress and get them to fix it for me?
    This is BS pure and simple.
    Fight the power!

  12. My friend brought this terrible news to my attention, last night. First off, let me thank you for all the hours of listening pleasure you’ve supplied for me. Secondly, I will take action with the petition, and any other outlet to stop this from taking place.
    Please keep us abreast with all the new happenings in this unfortunate situation.
    Respectfully,
    Jeff
    San Diego

  13. question: how long will it be until Pandora will shut down, presuming that we lose the appeal?

  14. Want to help pandora? Click on ads…. pretty simple, but increasing their clickthrough rate will help them sell ads, which helps them make money. I try to click at least 5 a day.

  16. This is ridiculous. I wish people would stop taking the good out of the Internet. Just leave the Internet alone!
    I already signed the petition because another online radio station I listen to had banners plastered all over.
    Work in the office is going to be a lot more lonely if they take our music away :(

  17. Every 5-10 mins. i have to restart pandora whats up with that? it pisses me off b/c its always saying “its taking longer than usual to do something go to another station” then that one doesn’t work

  18. I would recommend that you stop playing music from riaa labels. If they are going to attempt to prevent the internet from becoming a viable platform for listening to and discovering new music then don’t include any of their artists in Pandora. Still allow people to create stations based on riaa label music, but just don’t ever have this music play. my 2 cents.

  19. quit bitching about pandora, its not pandoras fault, its ur internet connection, bitch to your isp

  20. i just started on pandora about a month ago but i just signed the petition and sent it to a friend of mine and told him he had to sign the petition and to check out pandora and to forward the email to everyone he knows and makes sure they do the same cause i really like this website ive learned of so many new bands and i love learning about new bands. and the thing is when i learn of a new band theres the possibility that im going to buy the cd of that band so if its looking that its going to stop pandora and other internet raido station websites thats just dumb on there part!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  21. The RIAA doesn’t care about the profits they get from internet radio, they are far more concerned with physical copies. this is thus likely why they hiked it this high- I doubt they had no idea it could do this, I mean if they didn’t they’ll lower the royalties real quick after half the stations can’t play their music. at the very least they’ve hastened their [RIAA] demise. here’s to Indie music and Pandora fighting the good fight- cheers
    -PS I signed the petition too :)

  22. Hi Tim, and thank you for all your work. What a great site and idea that Pandora and the Genome Music Project is/are.
    PLEEEASE – If the words of the protesters of the copyright ruling go unheard and you are forced to shut down – before you do, please consider hosting your services on Canadian soil!
    RIAA has no clout here, in fact the CRIA (Canadian branch of the RIAA), has lost every legal challenge ever placed before consumers and businesses.
    And the fact that Canada already has a trade-agreement with the US, the US can’t muscle Canada into adopting the US copyright model, like they did with Australia.

  23. Everyone is touting writing their congress people…and to some this may seem like the only way to get this turned around. I would like to point out one thing folks…
    The CRB (Copyright Royalty Board) is an office of, and run by…The Librarian Of Congress!
    Do you really think their going to look out for your interests here? I would like to offer a counter proposal. We are starting a movement to go after the True Perpetrators of this decision, the RIAA’s Gestapo tactics, the use of the legal complexities and inequities to aid in the destruction of an entire small business segment…the only people who would truly benefit from destroying Internet Radio…The Labels!
    The “Don’t Buy Into It” campaign is working to become the “Ultimate Act of Civil Disobedience” By getting Americans to do the one thing that will really get the Labels, CRB’s, RIAA’s and even the Governments attention…NOT SPENDING OUR MONEY ON THE LABELS CRAP for 6 months!
    We can do this…if we DJ’s, Netcasters, Listeners can pull together to get the word out…From October 1st 2007 to March 1st, 2008…during the biggest sales time of the year…We Dont Buy Anything The Labels Put out! We can go for 6 months without buying their crap…they CANT go for 6 months without us buying their crap! It will be an undertaking as massive in scale as it sounds…we need to get the word out to at least 100 million americans, or more…we need to get the word out to our worldwide audiences! Imagine the possibilities…
    More information can be found at http://www.madchatter.net help us to inform everyone with the truly most effective tool we have…our money! By keeping it…we send the most powerful message there is…Dont Mess With Us! We are the People! We have the Power! Dont take away our freedom of choice!
    DON’T BUY INTO IT!

  24. I pray web radio is saved, especially for the people like me who aren’t able to get out of house very much, I’ve been listening to web radio for years now and when I first found out that there was this serious problem going on, its sad to know web radio maybe in jeopardy, I only found out about Pandora about 2 or more years ago and since then I’ve listened to Pandora the most, because Tim and his staff really have been working hard at their jobs and my theory is that everybody would have to realize how much time the artists and different workers (DJs) who help put the music on the radio for all to listen to whatever the people want to listen to is very important not just for the people who enjoy listening to web radio but I think its also important to help the people who bring the music to the radio keep their jobs. thanks. P.S. I wish and pray for everyone involved get something worked out

  25. I was stumbling on firefox last night and found Pandora. It is amazing! I typed in my favorite artist and was able to discover twelve more great bands within an hour of listening. I love the links to iTunes and Amazon. I also love the ability to skip a track if it isn’t something I like.
    I just wanted to thank you for such a great program. I’ll be telling my friends about it. Keep up the god fight!

  26. the jerks and their lawyers have no idea how much they have shot themselves in the foot. i’ve legally paid for thousands of dollars worth of music from iTunes, money i would not have spent if i had’nt found new artist and new material by listening to pandora. i’ve called and complianed to my congressman, i’ve signed your petition, and if there is anything else i can do do to keep this fine idea alive i’m more than willing. keep up the good fight. i’m in with you for the long haul. thanks!

  27. I am so glad I stumbled up on Pandora! I love the way they take your favorites and play songs similar to them. Am I the only one who likes these oddball songs?

  28. I can’t believe I just found this wonderful resource on my MSN site!!! It is the best gift of music. I have even put off buying an MP3 player as Pandora is so easy to use and meets my needs. Thank you so much. My only suggestion is for more World Music, especially from some great latin music bands I heard in Central America this winter. I am thinking of one band called Malpais.

  30. i hate pandora a lot just because its sooo slow you listen to a song and its running sooo slow that cant be then all of us will hate pandora and it lets your computer slow a lot when your in pandora

  31. I just found Pandora, but have been a loyal, paying launch.yahoo.com listener for years. The unfortunate reality is that net radio may have to become a relatively expensive paid service to survive. No more streaming utopia, however, I don’t think it’s a death knell.
    I think I pay 35 per year for Launch while it could easily worth 10 times that with very few changes. Simple truth is, I don’t have, or need, an extensive mp3 collection, because I have my own personal radio station that is *better* than any mp3 collection I could ever assemble. Why is it better? Because I don’t have to build the playlist. Launch also comes up with stuff that I would a) never have heard otherwise or b) have long forgotten about. I also find it very satisfying to block crap I don’t want to ever hear again. You can’t find that deal on any other radio format. The mix I’ve assembled is like none other on Earth. How much is that worth!?!? To me, more than $35 per year, and I’m sure others will agree.
    Sorry, I don’t mean to tout a competing product on Pandora, I’m sure Pandora is every bit as cool, if not cooler than Launch. I’m just more familiar with Launch.
    I said earlier minor changes are necessary. Really, it’s just one. I need to be able to stream my net radio to my mobile device. I can hear Verizon and Sprint shudder now, but that’s what I want – my net radio station everywhere. I’ve seen it done with Sirius, so I know the technology exists. If Sling can bring my hdtv to my phone, someone can bring my net radio station.
    As for monitization, lets throw around some numbers. If I read this thing right, it will cost a provider $500 to start a new radio station. Since every customer essentially creates his or her own station, that’s the first $21 per month off the top on a 2 year contract. Add $9 per month at the .0019 per track rate for 2010 gives the customer 4737 tracks over the course of the month. Figure a conservative 3 minutes per track and you’re at 8 hours of music per day for 29.5 days. That takes care of the label, but how do you keep the lights on and the bandwidth paid for? Sell stuff. Sell songs. Sell t-shirts. Sell concert tickets. Sell fanclubs. Sell advertising. All the radio station does is bring to your portal the masses of faithful listeners – and it keeps them coming back.
    The game will have to change in a big way. The free ride may be over, but, the future of net radio as a paid service should be bright.

  32. For the record, I did sign the petition. This was the reply from my Senator.
    Thank you for taking the time to contact me regarding royalty increases for Internet radio stations. I appreciate hearing from you. On March 6, 2007, the Copyright Royalty Board publicly decided to replace the revenue-based method of royalty payment with a per performance, per listener scale for commercial stations. The fee to stream one song to one listener is $.0008 in 2006 and gradually increases to $.0019 in 2010. Stations operated by tax-exempt, non-profit organizations would be charged a minimum of $500 per year for a certain number of listening hours.
    You may be interested to know that on March 7, 2007, the House Energy and Commerce Subcommittee on Technology and the Internet held a hearing entitled “The Digital Future of the United States: Part II – The Future of Radio.” You may view a webcast of the hearing on the committee’s website at . I hope you find the hearing interesting, and should legislation on Internet radio royalties be brought before the Senate for a vote, I will be sure to keep your thoughts in mind.
    Thanks again for contacting me. I hope you hear from you in the future on this or any other issue of concern to you.
    Sincerely,
    Russell D. Feingold
    United States Senator

  33. This website and all others like it are a blessing to those who have nothing else to cling to but music. Leave it to the RIAA to plot against the people and their passion. Pandora Forever

  34. Tim-
    Great job on the site…I know my friends and I listen to it all the time. I especially love how I can put one RARE song and still get a whole bunch of common music which I’ve never heard of. The RIAA should realize this a great way to help discover unknown artists.
    Anyway, keep fighting the good fight!

  35. I said earlier minor changes are necessary. Really, it’s just one. I need to be able to stream my net radio to my mobile device. I can hear Verizon and Sprint shudder now, but that’s what I want – my net radio station everywhere. I’ve seen it done with Sirius, so I know the technology exists. If Sling can bring my hdtv to my phone, someone can bring my net radio station.

  37. Pandora gave me a piece of home. I am not able to receive the music that i grew up with through any other media channel. It is sad to see unfair rulings take away which i once hailed as amazing and simply invogorating

  40. People shouldn’t put songs up on public sites unless money goes to the musicians or other legal rights’ holders.
    Unless the musicians agree. I applaud the decision.

  41. Their getting money either way mr.”freelance website design.” The ammount of advertising hat comes from pandora for the bands is massive. If pandora wa to be taken down, all that advertisement would go away and they would lose thousands in CD sales.

  42. so far the music i have heard i injoy ever much, and i’m proud to be part of this station and network!!

  43. I really appreciate this website. Because others can hear the songs through internet itself.
    ————————-
    Natalie
    Business Sales

  47. What is the latest news, do we still have a chance of having what we so long for??